gogs, hwntws dialects map.

[Hazel]

I take your point but, as Owain said, what is the purpose of this rigid dividing line. Why do people say "learn SW" or "learn NW"? Why do people ridicule each other's Welsh depending on what dialect it is?

As I said yesterday, it needs someone with more intelligence than I have to explain what I'm trying to say - that the language cannot be saved if everyone wants to keep pieces of it separate and adulterate it with Wenglish or whatever.

As Arwen just wrote to me and I agree, I do so respect S4C because they seem to have standardised a quality Welsh that everyone can read and understand. On the other hand, I receive a newsletter (whichshall remain unnamed) that would make any teacher who appreciates Welsh cringe.

Sometimes, the fact that "everybody does it" does not make it right. The same can be said for English or any other language. There are standards that need to be met if we are to have a language at all.

[Mynwy]

I don't think it's a matter of wanting to keep SW and NW separate - learn A or learn B is just advice - if I was going to move to the French part of the Basque country, it would make more sense to learn that dialect than to learn the one for the Spanish part. Coming from SW, I learnt SW forms first, but now I live in NW, it makes more sense to speak those forms. The different identities have not held back the language as a whole - the major crisis for the language (any of the dialects) have been the periods in history when Welsh people were discouraged (indeed banned in some instances) of speaking any Welsh at all.
Languages are fluid and will always adapt to include vocabulary from other languages, sometimes to the benefit, sometimes to the detriment, but it is a sense of national identity which will stop the language from dying out, and if people are proud to speak Welsh, in whatever form that may take, that is what will keep the language alive.
The North/South divide is not always as big an issue as it's made out to be - geography and poor transport infrastructure seem to have far more to do with it than dialect differences.

[Hazel]

I hope you are right.

[Mick]

'Rŵan is nawr backwards!!!!!!

Surely they're not all backwards in NW?!?


Mick

[Mynwy]

'Rŵan is nawr backwards!!!!!!

Surely they're not all backwards in NW?!?


Mick

ah, but nawr is also rwan backwards, so who's to say....?

[jammyjames60]

'Rŵan = yn yr awr hon.
Nawr = yn awr.

[Hazel]

'Rŵan = yn yr awr hon.
Nawr = yn awr.

Thank you, JJ. I was trying to remember "yn yr awr hon". "In this hour" It sounds much fancier. I think I'll switch.

[siopybont]

I didn't get away with that one, did I????!!!!!

[sianco]

I have a friend in Aberystwyth who says, before radio and television, her parents (NW) could not understand people in South Wales and vice versa. The difference was in pronunciation and, apparentl, it was a much greater different then than today. The idiot box may be the great equalizer. Forgive me if I rather fear that.

You hear sometimes of people from North + South speaking English to each other - but I doubt whether this was really necessary. A little bit of effort is all it takes.
There were itinerant preachers travelling between north and south in the 18th century when the accents were much stronger than they are now - and they sparked off revivals - so the congregations must have understood!

[Jashwntw]

In literary welsh I notice gallu is prefered to medru and mae... gen prefered to mae... gyda.

ie Mae gennyf ddau gwestiwn

Is this used in southern dialects at all?

I can imagine a gyda in the sense of something physically there with you. and gen as something non physical like having a question?

[Sionned]

I can imagine a gyda in the sense of something physically there with you. and gen as something non physical like having a question?

I'm a bit surprised you make that distinction. I don't believe I've ever heard it in any of the learning resources I've used (granted not an exhaustive list, but several different ones). I've only heard that the construction "Mae gen i ..." is preferred in the North and the "Mae ... gyda fi" in the South.

[Jashwntw]

It's the linguist in me I have absolutely no command over the welsh language at all. There is very little I can say about it with certainty. I am certainly not making statements about the language just throwing ideas out there to be clarified. You know it might be that in the old literary language they were two distinct uses of with, like gallu and medru were.

[Jashwntw]

I have copied this from plaid cymru's website:

Mae gennyf gysylltiadau cryf gyda’r gymuned ac rwy’n teimlo taw fi yw’r ymgeisydd delfrydol i’r ardal.

You can see that the speaker has distinguished the kind of context in which gen and gyda are used??

[Tahl]

I have copied this from plaid cymru's website:

Mae gennyf gysylltiadau cryf gyda’r gymuned ac rwy’n teimlo taw fi yw’r ymgeisydd delfrydol i’r ardal.

You can see that the speaker has distinguished the kind of context in which gen and gyda are used??

In that sentence, she or he is first using a possessive structure, then using 'with' in a context that's not about possession:
'I have strong connections with the community and I feel that I am the ideal candidate for the area.'

[Jashwntw]

I think this may be the right thread to ask if anyone can give more exanples of typical South west vocab

eg bennu for to finish